Who shot Jimmie and Mary Thompson? [Feuds]

Nancy Hatfield, daughter of Devil Anse who was known as Nannie, died about 30 years before I was born, so sadly I never knew her.  However, I have heard stories over the years about her, and I thought I would impart an especially interesting one here.

Nannie was, I was told, a very loving woman, but fiercely protective of her family.  So I was told that she would feud, though as a female, she was only peripherally involved in the famous Hatfield McCoy feud.

That actually sounds about right, since many women in my family are prone to feuding behavior.   Those “feuds” are usually nothing more than a protracted argument between them and another family, but those arguments can go on for years, to the point that no one even remembers who or what started it.

Nannie was married twice, to John Vance and then to Charlie Mullens.  John Vance was her cousin, which was not at all unusual back then.  His great-grandparents Susannah and Abner Howard were also Devil Anse’s great-grandparents, but they were descended through different children.

Interestingly enough, given the well-known dispute between the Hatfields and McCoys over a pig, this is yet another Hatfield story involving murder and a pig.

Nannie and John lived in Logan County and worked a plot of farmland, when they started having problems with pigs rooting in their corn.  If you are not familiar with farming, pigs rooting in the corn can destroy the entire crop very quickly, so it was a very serious problem.   The pigs belonged to Jimmie and Mary Thompson, who worked a landlocked parcel which required that they cross Hatfield/Vance land to get to their own crops.

The pig rooting problem had been going on a while, and they had been warned that if they did not control their pigs, they themselves would be shot.  Even to this day, people in my family will not warn someone twice about anything (though of course, we are also not threatening to kill anybody), so I am not really surprised at what happened next.

When the pigs returned one time too many,  John and Nannie waited in the field for the Thompsons to cut through, and carried through on the threat.  While cutting through the Hatfield/Vance land on their way to tend their crops, the Thompsons were shot.  Jimmie was shot in the abdomen and died a few hours later, and Mary was shot in the arm and elbow and suffered serious lifelong injuries.

The Thompsons were not armed, despite having been warned directly of impending violence.  It seems they did not take the warning seriously.  It is very possible they thought it was just angry talk, and not an actual death threat.

John Vance and Rhoda “Blackey” Vance Pack (who was also there) were charged with murder.  John was convicted and sentenced to ten years in prison.  The relatively light sentence, as I understand it, was due to the fact that the Thompsons had been warned, and were trespassing at the time.  Back then, trespassing was a very serious offense, and it could get you shot.

While it would not be surprising to anyone who watched the Hatfields & McCoys miniseries if a male Vance killed someone, or even if a male Hatfield killed someone, there have always been rumors that Nannie was the one who actually shot the Thompsons that fateful day.

As the story was relayed to me, the shooting of the Thompsons had little to do with the pigs, despite the dispute over them.  As I understand it, the Thompsons had a lot of children, and were extremely irresponsible parents who had tired of taking care of their large brood.  They removed their belongings from their cabin and set it ablaze, with the children still inside.  While the older children thankfully got the younger children to safety, when Nannie heard about what they had done, it sealed their fates, and she shot them both.  At least, that’s what I was told, and I have seen an old letter from one of the Thompsons’ daughters, which seems to back up that story.

While I really and truly hope that was not the case on either side, I have actually seen women in my family brandishing firearms in anger, and women in my family tend to be fiercely protective of all children, not just their own;  so I also cannot just discount those rumors out of hand.  The truth is, I do not know if she did it, or exactly why she (or John, or both) did it, and I doubt anyone but them ever actually knew for sure.  I do know it is possible Nannie did it despite John being convicted simply because, in my family, the husband will take the fall for the wife, for the sake of their children.

For the record, I would never in a million years pull a gun in anger, though I have lots of guns and am very skilled in their use.   I firmly believe that you do not ever pull a gun on a person, unless you actually intend to kill them.  So the only way I’d ever pull a gun on someone is if I felt that I had no choice.

I can however say that if pigs were constantly rooting in my corn, I might shoot the pigs after first warning the neighbors to keep them contained, but I’d feel very bad about it since the pigs were just being pigs, and the humans should have stopped them.  Maybe Nannie and John felt the same way about the pigs being pigs.  Either way, it would never even occur to me to kill the neighbors.

Of course, I was not raised by Devil Anse during the Hatfield McCoy Feud, either.

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“Hatfields & McCoys: White Lightning”

Sorry I haven’t posted in a while, but our friend we were caring for (lung cancer) passed away, and to be completely honest, I just didn’t feel like writing on the blog until a very nice fella by the name of “Jim” left a comment, and asked me if I have a comment on the TV show “Hatfields & McCoys: White Lightning”.  As a matter of fact (as you all probably figured) I certainly do.  I originally wrote this about a week or so ago, but I just realized that for some reason it didn’t post, so here we go again…

First of all, let me point out once again that the Hatfields and McCoys are no longer feuding – far from it, in fact, no matter what anyone may say on this “reality” television show.  We get along just fine, and many Hatfields and McCoys are good friends.  No “reality” TV show is ever going to change that, no matter how much they try.  And boy, does that show try to give the impression that we’re still feuding.  In fact, they come right out and say that the Hatfields and McCoys have been “feuding for over 100 years”.  That is an out-and-out lie, and anybody with an internet connection knows it.  In real reality, the feud ended over 100 years ago.

Now, let me also point out that while there are still very real feuds in West Virginia, especially in the southern part of the state where the family clans live in close proximity, none of those feuds involve the Hatfields and McCoys.  Sure, sometimes Hatfields or McCoys might disagree, with each other or with another family, and they might even cuss each other or get into a fist fight, but that’s not a feud.  That’s an argument, or at worst, a fight.  A feud is a full-out armed war between families, and if our families were feuding, believe me, I’d definitely know about it.  So I can say for an absolute fact that there is no feuding going on between the two families, regardless of how many times this television show states otherwise.

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Seeking McCoy Descendants To Tell Their Oral Family History

Since there are some knowledgeable McCoy family members commenting here, I am wondering if any of you would like to write about your oral family history, to add to this main part of the blog and thus make sure both sides are equally presented.

It is my sincere hope that if we compare and contrast the oral family histories of the two families, we can come to some consensus on what really happened, and why.

If any of you are interested, leave a comment here, making sure to include your correct email address in the comment form provided, and I will send you an email to discuss it further.  🙂

Hatfields & McCoys: Could genetics have contributed to the feud?

I ran across this article years ago, and thought those watching the Hatfields & McCoys may find it interesting.

The most infamous feud in American folklore, the long-running battle between the Hatfields and McCoys, may be partly explained by a rare, inherited disease that can lead to hair-trigger rage and violent outbursts.

Dozens of McCoy descendants apparently have the disease, which causes high blood pressure, racing hearts, severe headaches and too much adrenaline and other “fight or flight” stress hormones.

No one blames the whole feud on this, but doctors say it could help explain some of the clan’s notorious behavior.

You can read the article in its entirety at http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2007-04-05-hatfield-mccloy-disease_N.htm

Hatfields & McCoys: A comparison with the oral family history [Updated]

As previously stated, I hail from the Hatfield clan, of the infamous Hatfield/McCoy feud, and have heard the oral family history since I was a young child.  I thought it might be interesting for viewers of the Hatfields & McCoys miniseries if I compared the series to the family oral history, as well as history in general.

Devil Anse was a very tough character, that much is undeniable.  There is a reason they called him six foot of the devil and 180 pounds of hell, after all.  What they did not show at all is that he had a great sense of humor, and loved to play practical jokes.  He also looked absolutely nothing like Kevin Costner in the miniseries, as you can see in the photo at left.

The actors portraying the family are far more attractive than the actual Hatfield family (naturally, since they are actors), which is something my family finds endlessly amusing.  Not only did Anse look absolutely nothing like Kevin Costner, but Vicey was actually short and plump, and Johnse did not look like the dreamboat he is portrayed as being.  Roseanna McCoy was not even a blonde.  The offensive thing about that is, there is nothing wrong with not looking like a Hollywood actor, and in fact most people do not look like a Hollywood actor, so why did the actors not look anything like the actual people involved?  You can see individual photos of Johnse and Roseanna by clicking the link below to my post about their relationship.  The following is a photo of Devil Anse and his wife Levicey, to show you just how much they did not look like the actors in the miniseries.

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Devil Annz? No, Devil Ants.

Dear Mr. Costner,

Thank you for making the documentary miniseries Hatfields & McCoys for The History Channel.  As a direct descendant of Devil Anse Hatfield, and as a fan of your work as an actor (I especially enjoyed A Perfect World), I am very pleased that you chose to make this film, and I am hoping it fulfills its promise of historical accuracy.

The reason I am writing is for the purposes of historical accuracy, in fact.  While watching the trailer for Hatfields & McCoys, I noticed that you are mispronouncing the name Devil Anse.  It is not pronounced Devil Annz.  It is pronounced Devil Ants.  His given first name was Anderson, so it was a play on that name, intended to be a reference to the oldtime name for fire ants.  Just as fire ants attack without mercy, so would Devil Anse during the Civil War.

My concern is this, simply stated.  Since you produced the series and play the part of Devil Anse, I fear that the mispronunciation is in the miniseries itself, and will annoy me to no end while I am watching it.  Worse, it will cause all of America (and eventually the world as well) to start mispronouncing his name, though no one mispronounced it before.

I sincerely hope that will not be the case.  While I realize that you may have made an assumption about the pronunciation based upon what you have heard elsewhere, you must always remember (if in fact you ever even knew) that people in these parts tok uh lil difernt.

(And I can write that completely without humor or insult, since I freely admit that I talk like that as well.)

At any rate, I look forward to watching.

UPDATE:  After watching the program, I am happy to note that my fears were unfounded.  Not only did they pronounce Devil Anse correctly, they also pronounced Randall correctly (it is pronounced as Ranol, and he was also called Ole Ranol).

Now if only all the characters spoke with an authentic accent for this region, that would be great, since it is hard for even us to understand some of them.  I can therefore only imagine how difficult they are for others to understand.